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Zarnoss
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 Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 2:40 am Post subject: |
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| Fly wrote: | | Zarnoss wrote: | Yeah wasn't my doing , must have been the illuminati behind the scenes :/
I guess free speech isn't available on here. |
Gee willikers, a forum with rules which inherently curtail a facet of free speech, whoda thunk it eh? Perhaps you're against the word filter also because now they're playing elitist "lets rewrite the English dictionary" card as well. Why what arrogant little....
I dare say you give yourself a reason right there as to why, perhaps, you aren't treated in a positive light when posting certain opinions where, just because a poll was removed yet discussion stayed you immediately leaped to oppression by the establishment instead of continuing with your discussion and "socio-experiment". Effectively you took the whinge because someone removed a poll, should you then be negged because you did so or would this then counter the merits of the discussion that has been and possibly could be extrapolated form your baseline points?
On the point of the + & -, inherently the system was already broken to begin with simply because of the implemented timeframe where people had already built up rapports with others where those bonds would then influence opinions on the material, something which newer members obviously do not have. This isn't a fault of those who use it in such a manner since the problem will always repeat itself, this also doesn't mean that those who create meaningful enlightening and productive opinions are ignored however, just that, on occasion, minority opinion is stifled. |
I like how this has turned into a debate on the voting system from what I have read...there's flaws in it to be sure..but you kind off skewiffed of the track.
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Zarnoss
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 2:43 am Post subject: |
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SOZ double post : :/ (neg me ..whatever..)
| Charly wrote: | @Zarnoss
Well, I thought I'd have a look at your most recent posts to see what you were doing that we weren't. Seems like the main difference is you call people names and say 'shiz' a sodding lot.
Eh, pass. I'd rather be boring. |
Also why I say shiz is because i dunno wtf is acceptable on these forums so I let the free mind roam on what I am getting at.
Also I haven't called people names so get your facts straight.
*sigh* I guess it's that time on the lunar calendar.
Also the fact that the poll was removed seems a bit bizarre...I'd like to know who actually removed it and for what purpose.
It has nothing to do with having a gripe, It has to do with me setting a poll and it getting wiped with no reason why It was..seems kind of a bit drastic imo.
that is all.
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Cerebral
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:24 am Post subject: |
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Given that the poll in the Jack Thompson thread disappeared as well, I'd actually say noone deleted it, and it was a forum bug. I'll take it up with the admins and see if they can figure out what's going on.
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Charly
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Zarnoss wrote: |
| Charly wrote: | @Zarnoss
Well, I thought I'd have a look at your most recent posts to see what you were doing that we weren't. Seems like the main difference is you call people names and say 'shiz' a sodding lot.
Eh, pass. I'd rather be boring. |
Also why I say shiz is because i dunno wtf is acceptable on these forums so I let the free mind roam on what I am getting at.
Also I haven't called people names so get your facts straight.
*sigh* I guess it's that time on the lunar calendar. |
| Zarnoss wrote: | Btw you fking loser, torrenting stuff is causing our game prices to be higher.
Nice one..tard. |
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Kurupt
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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It's because of spoons. No one wants to get negged, so they don't speak their mind. Instead, they just say what everyone else does in an attempt to get more spoons.
I've seen it on other forums that implement similar rating systems. As soon as people can rate other people, they stop being themselves and start trying to become a sheep.
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Vervain
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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I would like to elborate on what Dances was saying about Crestfallen, Zarnoss and Dane Oss:
If you look at the last 2 months the only posts I can remember from Crestfallen are him showing up to whinge about the voting system, post in milestone threads and whinge about TheAnswer winning auctions and selling stuff on.
Zarnoss doesn't show up for months and then suddenly shows up decides that this place isn't full of enough people getting pissed off and decides to attempt to throw some shit in a fan.
Dane Oss on the other hand just hasn't posted too much recently.
The fact is Zarn what the hell do you expect. Look at the news lately: Jack Thompson Disbarred, various games getting RC'd and stuff like this. Do you think people are going to bloody argue about that stuff? The stuff that people WOULD argue about, being games that they think are/aren't good, HAVE been argued about. You just show up after all the **** and decide that because things are placid that nothing is good enough. How about you stay here for more than a day and THEN decide on whther or not people are arguing enough.
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Fly
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Zarnoss wrote: |
I like how this has turned into a debate on the voting system from what I have read...there's flaws in it to be sure..but you kind off skewiffed of the track. |
You obviously then don't understand what you're whinging about then. Opinion is heavily tied into the voting system where, the so called populist & bland opinion & agreeing are more likely then to receive benefits than the minority opinion would so people are more inclined to go the first route than the latter because of said benefits. It's a viable tangent to the inherent point of expressions of opinions, where, Ugh is probably the perfect example in that many saw him as passionate but negative and he rarely took the populist opinion which, in the end saw him both liked but also disliked for the same reasons with obviously the negatives far outweighing the positives in the end. Everyone isn't going to then follow in the footsteps and become outspoken where immediate benefits through expressing popular opinion instead of perhaps their own opinion is instantly rewarded in the form of $poons.
Reward someone and they are more likely to repeat, "punish" someone and they are more likely to either make an effort to adapt or to simply give up / force conflict. Thus is the voting system inherent to your opinion on the collective opinion.
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Frozencry
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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I'm just not around on the forums much any more because I'm too busy playing WoW. I enjoy getting into debates and whatnot but lately I just can't be bothered.
But really, I'm a gamer. That shouldn't be surprising that I'm in WoW more than I am on a gaming forum.
Anyway, I'm going back to WoW.
WoW.
/twitch
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IISpacebreakII
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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No offence but theres not much stuff in the news to argue about recently, like most of the stuff in the news everyone has the same opinion about these days. (Another game got banned, didn't see anyone happy about that) This is what religious arguments are good for because there NEVER one sided, everyones split up about them. They also never last because one moron unleashes a verbal whipping and the mods instantly put a cap in the threads buttox. I wish this site wasn't aiming for kid-friendliness because it would be a hell of alot more interesting if it wasn't!!!
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Dani
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Zarnoss wrote: |
*sigh* I guess it's that time on the lunar calendar.
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Aww possum, can't have your ass handed to you by a girl without bringing out the lamest excuse in the book?
I think you just earned yourself a serious downgrade in respect amongst your general peers here.
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Vervain
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| Posted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Ravenous wrote: | | Zarnoss wrote: |
*sigh* I guess it's that time on the lunar calendar.
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Aww possum, can't have your ass handed to you by a girl without bringing out the lamest excuse in the book?
I think you just earned yourself a serious downgrade in respect amongst your general peers here. |
I don't remember Zarn ever posting like this before and I've been here for a while. Too be honest I wouldn't be shocked if Ugh was giving him a helping hand in what to post considering Zarn said he was there with him.
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Quin
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:38 am Post subject: |
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| Fly wrote: | | Zarnoss wrote: |
I like how this has turned into a debate on the voting system from what I have read...there's flaws in it to be sure..but you kind off skewiffed of the track. |
You obviously then don't understand what you're whinging about then. Opinion is heavily tied into the voting system where, the so called populist & bland opinion & agreeing are more likely then to receive benefits than the minority opinion would so people are more inclined to go the first route than the latter because of said benefits. It's a viable tangent to the inherent point of expressions of opinions, where, Ugh is probably the perfect example in that many saw him as passionate but negative and he rarely took the populist opinion which, in the end saw him both liked but also disliked for the same reasons with obviously the negatives far outweighing the positives in the end. Everyone isn't going to then follow in the footsteps and become outspoken where immediate benefits through expressing popular opinion instead of perhaps their own opinion is instantly rewarded in the form of $poons.
Reward someone and they are more likely to repeat, "punish" someone and they are more likely to either make an effort to adapt or to simply give up / force conflict. Thus is the voting system inherent to your opinion on the collective opinion. |
I think you're wrong. Who cares about spoons, seriously?
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Zarnoss
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 10:06 am Post subject: |
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| Charly wrote: | | Zarnoss wrote: |
| Charly wrote: | @Zarnoss
Well, I thought I'd have a look at your most recent posts to see what you were doing that we weren't. Seems like the main difference is you call people names and say 'shiz' a sodding lot.
Eh, pass. I'd rather be boring. |
Also why I say shiz is because i dunno wtf is acceptable on these forums so I let the free mind roam on what I am getting at.
Also I haven't called people names so get your facts straight.
*sigh* I guess it's that time on the lunar calendar. |
| Zarnoss wrote: | Btw you fking loser, torrenting stuff is causing our game prices to be higher.
Nice one..tard. |
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Heheh, you got me there.
Honestly, I had forgotten that comment from that user as it was from someone that made his/her very first post and it was regarding pirating
which is a real no-no in my books.
I would never be openly disrespectful to someone from the general community here (well maybe unwittingly or misconstrued tongue in cheek, as it is not in my nature to do so).
Also regarding the lunar cycle remark..well, heh that was a bit harsh and generally unwarranted as I honestly couldn't remember that previous post.Might have had something to do with the bottle and a half of Black douglas drunk previously.(hence also the shoddy typos XD)
So I give my apologies for being an asshat that night.
On a side note though, it is good to see that there looks like there is actually quite a bit of focus on the subject that has happened on this matter, if anything I guess it has given the opportunity for people to have their say with people of varying views on the subject matter(even bringing up certain other aspects which people are unhappy with), as opposed to jumping into a hypothetical pool of sharks waiting to get ripped to shreds stopping a lot of people actually voicing their opinions because of this.The plus and neg system also enforces this behaviour which has been previously stated.
If anything pluses and negs should be given out by the mods/admins/staff.
At least then it is less prone to abuse by 'groupies' (which I see way to much of on here), eg:"Can't wait for that game too" followed by 7 plusses from the usual gang and goes back and forth through the culprits.
This puts alot of others at a severe disadvantage whether it be for wanting of spoons for auction or whatever.I'm not really fussed about the spoons as I dont use em , and as in the past will give them out as prizes or rewards but other people that may use them as their way of getting games through the auction system through general want of the game as opposed to serial offenders on here that would ebay it straight away etc or profit off it.(yes you know who you are)
this is where this system has failed.Look don't get me wrong , there are some great people on here but it seems that it is just a real sway from the old forum of old with interesting topics brought up, hypothetical views regarding gaming etc.
I see far too many generic threads on here which seem like the same one i have seen over and over for the tenth time rejiggered, like what games you own, how many etc.
I have seen forum nazis pounce on people for not using the search function about a game etc, but not for these topics...why?
Anyways..ima go have breakfast.
And again ladies sorry for the rudeness previously.
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GooberMan
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 11:37 am Post subject: |
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| Kurupt wrote: | | It's because of spoons. No one wants to get negged, so they don't speak their mind. Instead, they just say what everyone else does in an attempt to get more spoons. |
Really? Speaking my mind hasn't stopped me getting a boatload of $poons.
Of course, I only post when I think I have something to actually add to a thread rather than the first thing that comes to mind. I even start writing posts and shut the window down if I don't think I have a strong enough point to make.
Quality over quantity - it arguably works.
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Zarnoss
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 11:55 am Post subject: |
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Well I guess in some regards this is true.
But look at it like a giant group discussion, sure there are the wordsmiths and enthusiastic know it alls on the subject matter, but the 'other' types of people that hold back their views due to viewing either a group mob mentality showing severe bias or seeing one person get shot down quicksmart due to their views/belief on the subject regarding any other form of discussion of the subject in a differing point of view get shunned immediately leading them to think...well why bother here.
It's these people with an alternate view on things which leads to more discussion or a view from such a different point of view that it may not have ever entered that part of thought for the 'quality' posters.
BTW , I'm not talking about the people who just post, this game/company/subject sucks..I hate it.As this sort of tripe doesnt really add anything.
I have seen some new users come on here and post some generally good stuff and it never even got a plus due to the subject matter not being in the 90+% of what the general public really care about.Good on these people, shame they get no recognition for it though.
Oh btw goober, i do find your posts always quality.Keep em coming.
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Crestfallen
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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| DancesInUnderwear wrote: | I've mentioned it before, but the voting system does award popular opinions and snappy one liners more than rich, content filled posts, and I think that needs to stop, as it breeds useless threads like 'LOL I'M A GUY I'M GREAT CHECK OUT THIS LIST', which then brings on 3 times as many replies as a possibly intelligent thread like the Retro vs New School Megaman 9 thread.
But, and there's always a but, for all the whining about this, do any of the posters whining actually make these meaningful posts any more? Zarnoss, Dane Oss and Crestfallen have all made decent posts in the past, but haven't for ages, and now complain about it. Surely the best way to start a meaningful, intelligent discussion is to make a meaningful, intelligent post, not to make yet another useless post for people to go 'oh yes, i agree' to. |
To be honest mate my decline in posting has just been a natural decline which may or may not have something to do with the disappearance of other members I like/d. Doesn't have anything to do with the voting and lack of meaningful posts.
I still think the voting system has negatively affected the quality of the new wave of posters on the forum as a whole. 'Tis a shame.
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Buttmouth
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Zarnoss wrote: |
I see far too many generic threads on here which seem like the same one i have seen over and over for the tenth time rejiggered, like what games you own, how many etc. |
Like this one here: http://palgn.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=31868 ?
Maybe don't drink and post mate.
| Zarnoss wrote: | | I have seen some new users come on here and post some generally good stuff and it never even got a plus due to the subject matter not being in the 90+% of what the general public really care about.Good on these people, shame they get no recognition for it though. |
We're a community of people who share mostly common interests. Why would we all plus a post that
we don't care about just because Zarnoss happens to agree with it. If you agree with it - then you plus it.
Of course a post that everyone agrees on will see more attention.
Did you ever stop to think maybe we just generally all get along and agree on things?
I doubt you did. You just came on the board after a brief hiatus, and criticised
everything that you claim is a problem - insulting everyone in the process.
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ObsoletE
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:24 pm Post subject: |
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the thing is though, this being a gaming site, i'd imagine most people come here to discuss games, and for the most part, people's opinions on the subject of gaming will be pretty similar.
i mean, obviously there are points of contention, for example i make no secret of my general dislike for JRPGs, but at the same time i see no reason to post in every thread regarding the latest Engrish-titled game from Square (i mean seriously: Infinite Undiscovery? i thought Final Fantasty 2+ was a bad name.) about how i don't like them. it serves no purpose other than to irritate those who want to hold a proper discussion on the game.
it doesn't stop debates happening though, i mean the Too Human thread recently debated the merits of the game, and we still choose to agree to disagree over the perceived problems of that game.
i guess i just don't really know what you're looking for here.
like i say, by and large, we share the same interests here, so debates on game censorship, for example, probably won't happen, since all of us are gamers, and i don't think any of us want to play edited games.
piracy has been discussed in the past, most recently i think it was about the morality of pirating Virtual Console games when you owned the original cartridge. (although iirc, overzealous moderating did claim this thread, unfortunately - imo, not speaking on behalf of PALGN or it's management.)
the rep system seems to be another bone of contention, and while i see areas it could be improved, i guess the important thing to remember about PALGN, is that it isn't a commercial entity like IGN or Gamespot. it's maintained essentially as a hobby of the staff and moderators, and while we try to keep with the users wishes, there simply isn't the time to get everything that everyone wants working.
and even then, it's a case of balancing 1 issue derived from the system for another.
i mean, none of the suggested changes that have been made for the system are entirely fool-proof. having a set number of pluses/negs per time period comes up a lot, but there are days when MANY deserving posts are made, so what are you supposed to do. 10 good posts come along, you plus them all, using up your quota/ration, then an 11th post comes which is exceptional.
not being neg-able until you've posted x-number of times.
now, i see the merits of this suggestion, but then i don't really think that any of the noobs who've been negged didn't deserve it, and typically it's for posting spamily rather than for presenting a different point of view. (although The Genius did receive a negative welcome, but i made my thoughts on this clear already., and he/she has since proven themselves to be a good poster.)
ideally, i think the rep system (or at least the negs of the system) should reset after 100 posts. so you get 100 posts carte blanche to get how we work, stop spam posting while still being able to express themselves.
but then, it still doesn't solve the established cliques from mass plussing or negging something they disagree with (or even because they like/dislike the person posting).
and then i really suppose it comes down to what you think the rep system means. it was introduced as a means of reducing the spammy, 2 word responses ("i agree", "i disagree", "you're right", "you're wrong") posts that did plague the boards for a while just as much as visually representing you're approval/disapproval for the post's content, but it has changed to include congratulations, such as when people post milestone threads, or when they make large purchases, which while they weren't intended uses of the system, i personally don't see anything wrong with these uses either.
bleh, i think i typed enough on this for now, so i guess i leave it with this Abraham Lincoln quote:
"You can please some of the people all of the time and all of the people some of the time, but never all of the people all of the time."
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Infested Jibbs
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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I personally think alot of people need to stop giving such a shit about what other people think about them and their opinions.
I tend to find myself in all sorts of strange arguments, standing by my own opinions, generally by myself, against an overwhelming tide of popular(aka politically correct) opinion.While i routinely get gangbanged beyond all recognition for, god forbid, voicing a minority view(or sometimes a majority view, just an unpopular one), i end up saying what needs to be said and can never be branded a sheep.
That fat chick ambulance thread, the diablo 3 art thread, the thread about that mark ecko game being banned, the whole 'jap vs jp' mushroom cloud thread(which i can now look back on and laugh as i've spotted more then a few forumers who once crucified me in that thread now themselves saying they bought a 'jap' version game in the purchases thread).
I don't tend to flow with popular opinion, not because i 'know' the right answer and decide to go the other way simply to stir shit up-i simply speak my mind and i know for a fact alot of others share my stance yet for one reason or another don't let it show lest they be negged or find themselves disagreeing with one of the old boys-egads!
If you want to rock the boat, rock it.But rock it for the right reasons.Not to put others down, or to be a jerk or just cause you can, do it when you know an opinion you share isn't being voiced by anyone else and to show others that it's ok to disagree.
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Zarnoss
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 3:27 pm Post subject: |
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| BoomBoom wrote: | | Zarnoss wrote: |
I see far too many generic threads on here which seem like the same one i have seen over and over for the tenth time rejiggered, like what games you own, how many etc. |
Like this one here: http://palgn.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=31868 ?
Maybe don't drink and post mate. |
Well for clarification, I searched the forum and couldn't see a similar thread regarding trading in games (although to be honest from my experiences with the search function you basically need to put in the exact text to get the topic you are looking for, eg: "trading in games" gives me a whole lot of threads that have no relevance to what I am searching for.)
Generally I asked the question (poll) in that thread because I keep all my games and was interested in seeing if people were like me or constantly traded or a mix of both and the reasons for why they do so, which people talked about and was glad to see.
It was worth it for my own benefit to see what people were doing in this regard.
| BoomBoom wrote: | | Zarnoss wrote: | | I have seen some new users come on here and post some generally good stuff and it never even got a plus due to the subject matter not being in the 90+% of what the general public really care about.Good on these people, shame they get no recognition for it though. |
We're a community of people who share mostly common interests. Why would we all plus a post that
we don't care about just because Zarnoss happens to agree with it. If you agree with it - then you plus it.
Of course a post that everyone agrees on will see more attention.
Did you ever stop to think maybe we just generally all get along and agree on things?
I doubt you did. You just came on the board after a brief hiatus, and criticised
everything that you claim is a problem - insulting everyone in the process. |
For the record I didn't say I agree'd with it, I was stating that people come on here, maybe newbies, post something about a game/subject they have interest in and are subjected to the noise of crickets, It's pretty isolating.If people are so welcoming why not have a say about it? Like "Hey I don't know much about vampire squids...tell me more etc"
/\Yes it's a vampire squid! 
It's just a bit schoolyard like, that's all I am saying.
@Obsolete : Obs that is some damn fine remarks there, all sound pretty legit.Nicely worded and descriptive.
@Jibbs : Hahah good ol' Jibbs. 
I don't think people really give a **** about what other people think because they have their own preferences but it is still good to hear what peoples view on it are and if there is any sort of block whether it be via gangbanging or worries about being ostracized , well then there is a problem there because i'm not hearing all the various types of opinions for the sounds of mass circlejerking.
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Canis-Rufus
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:14 pm Post subject: |
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I don't see the fuss. I always post what I feel, and if someone has a differing opinion I don't chuck a wobbly over it. That said I would still defend my opinions if someone was outright bashing them, which so far hasn't happened on this forum. Yet.
I am generally a person who doesn't like too much conflict, so I am usually a laid back member who pops into say hello a few times a day without any negative words. It may come across as just agreeing, but thats just what I am like.
Oh, and I prefer PS3 to 360! There I said it 
How that for speaking your mind 
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Fly
Status: Offline
Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Posts: 1774
$poons: 250.40
Location: Melbourne
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Quinsisdos wrote: |
I think you're wrong. Who cares about spoons, seriously? |
Not the actual point, actual point being pavlovian conditioning where being presented with a neutral stimulus (postbit) and then the external stimulus of some significance (the voting system tied to spoons) just this sheer fact that they are tied is enough to form a reflexive bond to a person where they are then trained to associate witty retorts & populist diatribe (different to expressive opinion) with a benefit, which, in context is significant (spoons being used in the previous auction system, for some game exchanges, to show popular threads and posts ego++)
Where then, actually caring about spoons or caring that you're being rewarded becomes secondary to actually being used to being so and the association that brings on an instinctive level.
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Eyce
Status: Offline
Joined: 22 Oct 2003
Posts: 3780
$poons: 6.60
Location: Geelong, Vic.
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Quinsisdos wrote: | | I think you're wrong. Who cares about spoons, seriously? |
Cough.
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Zhou
Status: Offline
Joined: 23 Jul 2007
Posts: 4555
$poons: 382.11
Location: Summoner's rift
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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^ havent seen any auctions (apart from fetidchimp's) for quite a while. Whens the next vip for a month coming up ? 
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Buttmouth
Status: Offline
Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 2593
$poons: 64.70
Location: Green
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| Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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^ Damn, I should be auctioning these things off instead of giving them out for free... Opportunity missed!
Will use it next time I have some stuff I don't need/want.
Zarnoss, I do see what you're trying to say now (a bit). Sorry for being such a rude bastard.
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