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ObsoletE
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 Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2007 11:30 pm Post subject: |
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| crestfallen wrote: | | ObsoletE wrote: | | it's a first person shooter in the same sense as Elder Scrolls 4: Oblivion is a first person shooter. |
Oblivion doesn't have guns. |
that's almost my point.
Oblivion features a FP view, as well as "shooting" (spells and ranged weapons) but no one calls it an FPS because the focus isn't on this aspect, but the role-playing aspect.
Metroid Prime is similar in that its also a game, with an FP view, with aspects of shooting, but the focus isn't on that aspect, from what little i've played, it's focus is on puzzle solving - if i had to draw a parallel to another game, i'd say it's like Soul Reaver. you have a big world, but you can't get access to some areas until you've gained the ability to climb walls, or phase through gates, or swim - etc. etc.
(i'm not, by any means, claiming that Soul Reaver is the definition of this type of game, it's just the one that comes to mind immediately when i see the layout of MP.)
| wwe_westy wrote: | I decided to see what Wikipedia said about FPSs and what was the first picture I saw - see for your self:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-person_shooter
Look familiar?
EDIT: Reading through the FPS wikipedia page more, it has made reference to Metroid Prime: Hunters being a FPS and Metroid Prime 3: Corruption being an FPS. |
putting aside the fact you're using Wikipedia as anything more than a guide, there are some points made in the article that goes against what you're arguing.
| Wikipedia wrote: | | Meanwhile, in the world of consoles, Metroid Prime was released. It was a quasi-FPS with platforming and third-person elements for the Nintendo GameCube, set in a comparatively large world that focused more on exploration than combat; it also featured a unique approach to plot narration through a "scan" mechanic, which allowed the player to piece together the story and the game's myriad background details by examining enemies, computer screens and other objects. It utilized a lock-on based targeting system similar to that used in Nintendo's first-party title The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time. Due to its weighting towards exploration, typical of the Metroid series' style, many critics referred to the title as a first-person adventure game. |
the bolding was done by me to point out that even this author isn't really putting the game wholly into the FPS basket.
and just in case you wanted to question my questioning of the validity of Wikipedia, it claims that Oblivion is also an FPS, under the heading "The 2000s: Strides for Realism".
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wwe_westy
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| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Wikipedia wrote: | | Games released or in development for Nintendo's Wii console include Metroid Prime 3: Corruption, Far Cry: Vengeance, Call of Duty 3, Medal of Honor: Vanguard and Red Steel, five first-person shooters which use the motion-sensitive Wii Remote as an aiming device instead of the traditional mouse or analog stick |
| Wikipedia wrote: |
In FPS games for the Nintendo DS, (such as Metroid Prime Hunters and Resident Evil) the D-pad is used for walking and strafing, while the touch screen is used similar to a mouse for aiming. Shooting is usually used with the L button, but for some games, like Metroid Prime Hunters have left handed configurations. |
| Wikipedia wrote: | | Metroid Prime: Hunters (2006) — Notable for being the first critically acclaimed and overall successful FPS on a handheld gaming console. Widely praised for its multiplayer online and precise aiming. |
I did the bolding myself aswell.
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ObsoletE
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| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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^ no one disputed Hunters actually, just the GC Prime games.
but again, why would you use Wikipedia as a credible source when, as i pointed out, that very article claims Oblivion is an FPS?
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A13x
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| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Some dude from Gamespot via google wrote: | I agree with every word. Which is why I think it is a gross injustice to label every game in the first person perspective with a gun as a "first person shooter". Most are by definition , action games or action/adventure games that just happen to be in the first person perspective. I think a shooter is a game that strictly sticks to the roots (Quake, Unreal, Serious Sam, Doom).
The day people stop complaining about so many "shooters" coming out, is the day that they realize that they are all mostly action/adventures games like any other (Riddick, Halo, Lost Planet), and that actual "shooters" like Serious Sam are few and far between. |
It may feature firing your cannon at creatures from a first person perspective, but the core gameplay of Metroid is not focused on going and trying to shoot everything, it is about exploring the environments, solving puzzles and achieving the mission goals presented to you. Whereas a game like Call of Duty presents to you scenarios in which you need to shoot and kill every enemy in the area to progress to the next area where you must do the same thing etc, and is focused on the shoot-em up side of things more-so than puzzle solving and adventure attributes like Metroid.
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3mt
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| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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GCN metroid prime series ARE in fact first person shooter, just that its got a lock on button. You're in first person perspective, and you shoot, thus making the word 'first person shooter'
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Aftershock
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| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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/\ No.
Just because you shoot, does not make it a shooter. In metroid the focus is far more on exploration etc, which is what defines a game, the focus of it.
In CS, (with a decent team/teamwork) you use strategies to achieve success. You implement those strategies in real time, thus (by your logic) making it a RTS. Its not. the focus is on shooting, not strategies, thus making it a shooter, not an RTS.
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Capoeira
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| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:47 pm Post subject: |
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| 3mt wrote: | | GCN metroid prime series ARE in fact first person shooter, just that its got a lock on button. You're in first person perspective, and you shoot, thus making the word 'first person shooter' |
In a literal sense maybe, but not when grouping it into the genre.
The reasons are already spelled out in the four page of this thread. There's no point in going over them again.
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wwe_westy
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| Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2007 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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^ Agreed, we have gone off topic, but there's not a whole lot more to discuss on this topic.
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mcerto
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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...so we've all come to agree on the primes being a first person adventure...yes?
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Capoeira
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, like 5 years ago.
Anyway, them screens... they sure do look like a Gamecube game etc...
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wwe_westy
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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^ I have to disagree with you there - I think they look quite different to any GC game. (but we discussed this like 6 years ago)
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unlachs
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 6:54 pm Post subject: |
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| mcerto wrote: | | ...so we've all come to agree on the primes being a first person adventure...yes? |
this thread is so 2002
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mcerto
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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meh, i was out for the whole weekend, so i missed the developments, just wanted to be sure no one else came out with "0h no3s! pr1m3 is teh 1337 in ult1m47e fpsing!!1!!one!!1!eleven"
so yeah...nice shots ey? 
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Cerebral
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, the shots do indeed look good. It's a visual step up from Echoes, no doubt about that, but I'm not seeing all the spiffy lighting/depth of field effects from the E3 demo in these screens. It's likely going to look more impressive in motion, in a more advanced build.
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Crestfallen
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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^ To that extent I hope Retro show more common sense than to go overboard with the bloom.
I hate bloom.
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Capoeira
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| Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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Just so you all know, I'm not being entirely serious with the whole 'looks like a Gamecube game' lark. Sure, I don't think it's that big a step up from what we could have seen on that little purple box, but I'm genuinely interested to see what Retro have come up with for the big finale.
Also video > screens. Always has been, always will be. I'll eat my keyboard if Retro don't have some crazy footage to show of this game at E3, hell if Nintendo don't do something special with it during its press conference even.
That said, it's going to take a lot to get me to want to play this game. Slightly better visuals and screen-pointy action ain't going to cut it.
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3mt
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Capoeira wrote: | Just so you all know, I'm not being entirely serious with the whole 'looks like a Gamecube game' lark. Sure, I don't think it's that big a step up from what we could have seen on that little purple box, but I'm genuinely interested to see what Retro have come up with for the big finale.
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? is prime 3 really the big finale?!
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Capoeira
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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| 3mt wrote: | | Capoeira wrote: | Just so you all know, I'm not being entirely serious with the whole 'looks like a Gamecube game' lark. Sure, I don't think it's that big a step up from what we could have seen on that little purple box, but I'm genuinely interested to see what Retro have come up with for the big finale.
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? is prime 3 really the big finale?! |
Um... yes. You're being serious right? It's kinda hard to tell.
The 'Prime' saga was meant to play out over three games, Corruption being the last of the trilogy. I can only assume they wrap up the story, but for the life of me, I don't remember there ever being a story.
What was the story they were supposed to be wrapping up again? I recall fighting a big-ass Metroid and the end of Prime 1 and a big-ass bug looking thing at the end of Echoes. I'm assuming I'll be fighting some big-ass <???> at the end of Corruption, but as for the narrative that's supposed to tie the three together... no idea.
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ObsoletE
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Cerebral
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David
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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Metroid games are always about Samus taking on a federation mission, usually to defeat the Space pirates. Metroids are usually involved in the Space pirates' plans, primarily because that's the Space pirates latest thing, and the games are set in a very short period of time (the whole series start to finish would be about a year). The prime series is no exception, and the whole 'gaiden' series is set between Metroid 1 and 2.
Prime 1 was about a Metroid variation in Talon IV (due to Phazon radiation) called Metroid Prime, and the Space Pirate's efforts to use it as a weapon. Samus followed the Pirates there. There is a major sub-plot about the Chozo and Metroid Prime on the planet.
Prime 2 was about a federation mission to a planet called Aether, to find out what happened to a bunch of federation marines who were lost when tracking some Pirates. While there, Samus gets caught up in a centuries long war between the Luminoth and the Ing. Metroid Prime (in the Chozo Phazon suit) has also followed Samus there.
Prime 3 is on another series of planets. There will almost certainly be Pirates, Metroids, and federation. But the main plot will be to tie up the Metroid Prime 'sub-plot' of the whole series, which leads onto Metroid II's quest to destroy all Metroids in the Galaxy.
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mcerto
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| Posted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 10:12 pm Post subject: |
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yeah, as well as finding out the origin of phazon, which is something thats tied heavily into all 3 games, and exactly why/how its being/been launched into space, and if its underlying intentions is evil...which id guess it is
but yeah, pretty much exactly what David said
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Capoeira
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| Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 12:44 am Post subject: |
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Well, that almost makes the games sound... interesting.
I guess it just goes to show how forgettable it all was, not to mention how important actual voice work can be to a game's story.
It's interesting; the Prime games are the only single player titles where I have failed to remember the main narrative. Pick any other game from the recent past and I could tell you what the jist of the story was, but with this, I was drawing a complete blank.
It's a single player game. Narrative is key. That's saying something.
Whoever it is making the choice about keeping voice work out of the games is a total loon. Leaving Samus voiceless, I can understand that completely, but leaving the supporting cast as mutes? There is no excuse for that.
I did however remember something about their finally bringing in a voice cast for the final game. I hope this is true. If so, maybe I'd do a better job of actually remembering what the f**k I was supposed to be fighting for.
/Otacon
Wait, I'm not even planning on playing this! Why do I even care? Must be the hardcore gamer in me. I knew it was in there somewhere. I must find and destroy it.
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Cerebral
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Capoeira
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| Posted: Tue Jul 10, 2007 1:11 am Post subject: |
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| Cerebral wrote: | | Yeah, Prime 3 will feature voice work (the federation captain speaks to samus in the demo video). It's not exactly awe inspiring VA, but it's a step in the right direction. |
Excellenté. That's actually quite reassuring to know. I hope this added interest in effective narrative delivery means great things for the remainder of the story. You know, for all your sakes...
Not that I care or anything 
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