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kartanym




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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 8:32 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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admeister
Never really played single tracks anyway, always went straight to the GP or time trial. The one thing I do hate so far is the change to the balloon battle mode. Instead of three attached to your kart, it's a cumulative points score.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 8:51 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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OK yeah, I don't really see the big problem. I don't think I would never play a single race anyway in single.
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kartanym




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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 10:13 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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admeister
The fun with battle mode, originally, was trying to survive the longest. Now it's more of a standard shoot everything you have mode with slightly less strategy involved. It's not bad, don't get me wrong, but I don't think it was a necessary change.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:03 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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Maybe I spoke too soon about the lack of a single race option. Online is heaps of fun!
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:27 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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Maybe that was Nintendo's plan?
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kartanym




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:54 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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Tried to get into the plagn leagues you guys set up, but nothing seemed to work properly. So I played some random online, not half bad. Barely any lag during matches, mostly japanese players though.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:33 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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kartanym wrote:
Tried to get into the plagn leagues you guys set up, but nothing seemed to work properly. So I played some random online, not half bad. Barely any lag during matches, mostly japanese players though.


We made a new one, as the old one was stupid and kept coming up with errors and not matching us up. 65-8031-9409-6084 if you haven't already added it.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:02 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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Jaws
topaz
I'm trying to like this. I really am.

But... it just feels like every race relies far too heavily on luck. I've had issues with the blue shell ever since it was introduced, and it's an irritation that still persists. It completely ruins the game for me.

The game punishes you for playing well. I don't understand the reasoning behind this. In any other game, if you're in last place, you strive to get better. It's satisfying and reinforces your skill set. In Mario Kart, you can just linger at the back of the pack, spam a few imbalanced items, and speed your way into the top three. It's frustrating.

Why bother playing it in the first place if you're going to be greeted with a slap in the face upon reaching your full potential?
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Jarrod




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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:58 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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I can see where you're coming from, but you might as well pack it up now and not bother, because you're playing the wrong series. Mario Kart hasn't had a pure competitive edge since the first one. Ever since Nintendo has bloated it with Blue Shells and other luck variables, starting with Mario Kart 64.

That's Mario Kart as it is today, and unless you join no items communities it's just tough titties.

I'm not finding it too bad. Compared to Mario Kart Wii Nintendo has toned down a lot of the little annoyances. Bullet bill isn't over powered anymore, blue shells can hit everyone on the track (like they did in MK64), coins are back, and some of the junk items have been removed. The game still has the occasional "fuck you" moment of getting pounded by a blue shell right before the finish line and losing your position, and the single player AI still cheats in 150cc, but it's not in the ballpark of how atrocious MKWii's imbalance was.

TLDR: Problems exist but I'm not finding them as extreme as you are. But competitive MK is dead regardless unless you join itemless communities.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:34 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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Soft.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:28 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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That's the beauty of MK. You can be coming dead last but know you can get back into it at any time.
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DancesInUnderwear




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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:49 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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Bronze wrote:
I'm trying to like this. I really am.

But... it just feels like every race relies far too heavily on luck. I've had issues with the blue shell ever since it was introduced, and it's an irritation that still persists. It completely ruins the game for me.

The game punishes you for playing well. I don't understand the reasoning behind this. In any other game, if you're in last place, you strive to get better. It's satisfying and reinforces your skill set. In Mario Kart, you can just linger at the back of the pack, spam a few imbalanced items, and speed your way into the top three. It's frustrating.

Why bother playing it in the first place if you're going to be greeted with a slap in the face upon reaching your full potential?


Because it can still be fun? Surely your entire enjoyment of a game - and this isn't just applicable to video games, but board games, sports, whatever - aren't solely defined by winning 100% of the time.

More to the point, however, I haven't played MK7, but I've played every other Mario Kart, so maybe its drastically worse here (though most impressions would seem to indicate it isn't), but I really don't think the items completely negate the need to increase your skill to get better. Me and my friends used to play a lot of Mario Kart. I was better than all of them (just like in all aspects of life icon_razz.gif), so on the Gamecube version, we started to exclusively play Baby Park, 9 Laps, with items set to high. It did help my friends pull of some victories that they may not have gotten in other cases, but you know what? I still won the lion's share of the races. Items flying every which way or not, skill still helps. I'm sure this Mario Kart is no different.

And if its all too much of a problem, surely then you could just look at one of the multitude of racing games that aren't Mario Kart.
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Jarrod




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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:02 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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Eh, some people dont enjoy having hard work undone by what is essentially the roll of a dice, especially in a racing game. I can understand that.

But it's factually less unbalanced than Mario Kart Wii, so if you got one iota of enjoyment out of that you're good to go.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:24 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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DancesInUnderwear
But then those people shouldn't be really playing Mario Kart. Mario Kart has always been like that, and I quite enjoy it. Sure, it's frustrating to lose first place half a second from winning, but it's all part of the fun! Mario Kart has never been a completely serious game to me, more of a game that's fun to kick back and enjoy, and if you lose, well, there's always next time!
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:27 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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G3ck0
^ What he said.

Except for the fact this part
G3ck0 wrote:
more of a game that's fun to kick back and enjoy, and if you lose, well, there's always next time!
should apply to, you know, every game ever, surely.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:31 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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I'm a little torn on this issue (and it applies to the majority of multiplayer Nintendo games). I love messing around and purposely staying last so I can chain Lightning Bolt friends and family alike (to their dismay), but power sliding and nailing those crazy shortcuts are also incredibly rewarding as well.

The original SNES Mario Kart and the GBA Mario Kart Advanced were quite competitive and were a lot less forgiving with what items you got regardless of how far behind you were, but I don't mind that the series has evolved into a party game.
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kartanym




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PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:23 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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Keeping all that in mind, perhaps we should have a no items league, all snes based tracks icon_wink.gif
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:33 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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I'm finding winning gold (let alone three stars), on single player GP 150cc mode a lesson in supreme frustration, yet I always come back for more. I fear for the safety of my 3DS system, but who knows, overcoming and accepting the cheating AI in MK7 may make me a more patient person icon_smile.gif
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:57 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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Jaws
DancesInUnderwear wrote:
Because it can still be fun? Surely your entire enjoyment of a game - and this isn't just applicable to video games, but board games, sports, whatever - aren't solely defined by winning 100% of the time.


It's a racing game. A race by definition is a challenge to see who can achieve the fastest result in a competition. So yes, when I play Mario Kart, I adhere to the fundamental point of racing; to try and place first.

I find it unfortunate that skill takes a backseat to accessibility in the series and obscures an otherwise solid and entertaining racing game. My enjoyment of a game comes from the acquisition, refinement, and application of skills gained through the course of gameplay. You can see this is just not possible in MK7 (or basically any MK since MK64).

So yes, I'm playing the wrong game. Just knocked over all 150cc cups and unlocked Mirror Mode, but I've experienced more frustration than elation in doing so. I'd consider the series an unfortunate casualty of Nintendo's raging casual gamer boner.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 1:23 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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Jaws
Bronze wrote:
You can see this is just not possible in MK7 (or basically any MK since MK64).


It is possible though, but not in the purest sense, which is where the problem lies and why you don't enjoy it. Your best bet it to stop playing the crappy single player and jump online, as though the item balance issues still exist, the rampant AI rubber banding and cheating is gone.

150cc in single player torturous.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 10:03 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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Bronze wrote:
DancesInUnderwear wrote:
Because it can still be fun? Surely your entire enjoyment of a game - and this isn't just applicable to video games, but board games, sports, whatever - aren't solely defined by winning 100% of the time.


It's a racing game. A race by definition is a challenge to see who can achieve the fastest result in a competition. So yes, when I play Mario Kart, I adhere to the fundamental point of racing; to try and place first.

I find it unfortunate that skill takes a backseat to accessibility in the series and obscures an otherwise solid and entertaining racing game. My enjoyment of a game comes from the acquisition, refinement, and application of skills gained through the course of gameplay. You can see this is just not possible in MK7 (or basically any MK since MK64).

So yes, I'm playing the wrong game. Just knocked over all 150cc cups and unlocked Mirror Mode, but I've experienced more frustration than elation in doing so. I'd consider the series an unfortunate casualty of Nintendo's raging casual gamer boner.


I, again, disagree with the statement that the "application of skills is just not possible" in Mario Kart. If that were the case, a baby / chimp / drinking bird would be able to win as many times as a seasoned gamer... and I don't think this is the case. At all. Get better at the games, and you do win more. Yes, you might get hit by some blue shells and lose a match or two but I'm pretty confident you'll win the vast majority of them thanks to your skill.

But forget about all that. I just don't understand at all what you were expecting. Mario Karts party game-esque ways have been clear ever since MK64 (as both you yourself and others have mentioned), long before Nintendo's 'raging casual boner' had even grown pubic hair. And even the first one had horrific rubber banding and unfair item distribution (why did CPU Mario and Luigi get Star Power whenever they want? Unfair!). I could understand getting frustrated if next Gen Turismo became Mario Kart, I really could, but this is a series where the last 6 out of 7 titles are like this - surely by this point you know what you are getting into. Its really no different to coming in and complaining that the newest Mario Kart doesn't have authentic real world style handling. Or a rich storyline. Or something. Its just not what the series is about.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 12:29 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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Playing Mario Kart 7 made me feel like going back and playing Double Dash. I put the game into my Wii, and man, it's so different. The controls are much more sensitive, and the drifting is much looser. The sense of speed (especially in 150cc) is way better than in Mario Kart 7 I reckon. The graphics still hold up pretty well too. I really do love Double Dash, still the best game in the series imo.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 10:22 am Post subject: Reply with quote

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Couldn't agree more admeister.. Had a bit of a play on double dash last weekend, still holds up so well... The 2 character per kart system I loved, but more so the ability to race 16 races back to back in a single GP.. Some seriously awesome memories!!!

After playing 200+ races of MK7, and 3 starred most of the 150cc / mirror mode, I've noticed the harder you work the luckier you get.. If you race supremely well throughout the entire course, maintaining 1st position and blue shelled on the line, if you've raced well enough you'll still cross the finish line first.. The first few hours were frustrating as anything, but I've noticed after playing a tonne the last few days, provided I get off to a great start, and hold items behind me literally 95% of the races, I'm less likely to get blue shelled on the line, and when I do - more often than not i will have enough of a lead to straggle across the line in 1st still... Obviously I still get beaten here and there, but I'm finding it a lot less common now than I was on the weekend..
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 10:17 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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Ok, so i joined this PALGN group
But, how do i add to a list or, actually, just how does the whole communities thing work anyway?
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 10:20 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

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admeister wrote:
The graphics still hold up pretty well too. I really do love Double Dash, still the best game in the series imo.


And I thought I was the only one who liked it #brofist.

I still play it every now and then. It's so fun having one player throwing the items and another driving the kart. Good times.
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