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Pagan's Mind




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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Yeah that motioninjoy or whatever it's called was headache inducing to use. I went and bought the 360 controller for Windows and it works like a charm with pretty much everything.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Phreakuency wrote:
Really disappointed with Skryims graphics. It has the worst snow texture I've ever seen.


I was disappointed with the fact it uses your CPU to render the shadows.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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PixieGirl
emwearz wrote:
I was disappointed with the fact it uses your CPU to render the shadows.

I really wish people would at least try to understand tech before commenting on it.

Let me put it this way - if your CPU tried to render the shadows at 1080p, you'd be lucky to get 5 frames per second.

Syncying up the GPU with the CPU is an entirely separate matter.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Resident Evil 5... I didn't really enjoy this game, but I found it to be one of those games where I'd watch a cutscene and find it difficult to believe that my computer was really rendering what I was watching. Looking at the screenshots, they don't really do it justice, and I'm wondering if it's already dated looking by now. But I think in motion it looks a lot better.

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GooberMan




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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Uhm. You know many of RE5's cutscenes were prerenders, right?
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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By prerendered do you mean, videos already recorded with CG and popped into the game? I don't think so. The only cutscene I remember being a video was the very first one before you start, and I could tell because it was obvious with compression artifacts on the video. I know none after that were prerendered because A) I noticed graphics changes when I was messing around with settings, B) I have fraps on all the time and I noticed framerate dips anywhere between 60 and 30, and C) all cutscenes were crystal clear, where as the first video was not.

It might be different on the consoles though, which would make sense. But on the PC these were rendered...
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Pagan's Mind




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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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PixieGirl
They look rendered to me. Much better than the console versions.
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GooberMan




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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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I'd expect the Jill flashbacks to be pre-renders, same with the Michael Bay plane crash just before the end.

Easy test - put on an alternate costume and watch them again. Any that use the default costumes are pre-renders.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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PixieGirl
they all wear what you are wearing at the time
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GooberMan




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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Yeah, I remember it more clearly now. Similar to RE4, many real time cutscenes. Although while RE4 only went pre-rendered for the introductory video, I seem to recall seeing more than just the intro video pre-rendered in RE5.

And I can't really ever bring myself to load that game up again, so I can't confirm if the ones I suspect being pre-rendered are actually pre-rendered.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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GooberMan wrote:
emwearz wrote:
I was disappointed with the fact it uses your CPU to render the shadows.

I really wish people would at least try to understand tech before commenting on it.

Let me put it this way - if your CPU tried to render the shadows at 1080p, you'd be lucky to get 5 frames per second.

Syncying up the GPU with the CPU is an entirely separate matter.


I did not say it only used the CPU, I said that it used it. Here is what I know and care about.

With the game on high I can chuck levels of AA on without my frame rate dipping or going higher. I drop the shadows down and I go from mid 30FPS range up to the 40fps to low 50fps in the same screen.

Ill get in on the Skyrim fun.


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GooberMan




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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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emwearz wrote:
I did not say it only used the CPU, I said that it used it.

And you know what? Every single graphics operation in your game uses your CPU too. So either you didn't know what you were talking about in the first place or you like stating the obvious. Which one is it?

(Note: I'm likely to go off on a long rant about how DirectX and Windows works if you try challenging that, and I don't particularly want to do that in what's meant to be a screenshots thread. And I am tempted to get a PC copy of Skyrim so I can run it through PIX and see where the graphics bottleneck is exactly.)
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emwearz




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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Stating the obvious I guess, which is that your a bit of a dick.

My point was that the shadows depend greatly on your CPU, fair more extensively than it should. My own FPS jumping up so high show this to me, as I can raise and lower different graphic options with nothing changing on the FPS front (meaning I am being bottlenecked by my CPU), I lower the shadow setting and my FPS sky rockets.
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GooberMan




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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 12:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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emwearz wrote:
My point was that the shadows depend greatly on your CPU, fair more extensively than it should. My own FPS jumping up so high show this to me, as I can raise and lower different graphic options with nothing changing on the FPS front (meaning I am being bottlenecked by my CPU), I lower the shadow setting and my FPS sky rockets.

Hasn't this always been the case for any game with traced shadows? (ie. not a blurry circle)

Sure it might be a little worse in Skyrim if the geometry is complex or it's not too well optimised, but I'm fairly confident it's been happening in games for a very long time now. It's always one of my first cuts when trying to boost framerates.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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PixieGirl
Shadows are an amazingly tricky subject to talk about, simply because there's several different methods used in modern games.

At its simplest, if it's generating shadow volumes for light occluders, then that does require the creation of a shadow volume. Traditionally, this has been done on the CPU. Previous gen hardware lacked vertex shaders, and even with current gen hardware it's tricky to create shadow volumes on the vertex shader (it involves throwing more polys at the shader than it needs). Geometry shaders are fairly perfectly suited for shadow volume generation. But no current gen console hardware supports that, nor does DirectX 9.

For Skyrim, I'd expect that shadow volume generation to be done on another thread, or SPUs on the PS3. Either way, it'd be done in a task-based paradigm. And this is step 1 in the whole "lazy console port" argument I see popping up - an Xbox 360 has 6 hardware threads, the PS3 has 2 hardware threads and 6 SPUs, and the PC has, well, anywhere from 2 to 12 hardware threads. The amount of parallel processing any of those consoles can do far outmatches the minspec PC.

As always though, it's not that simple. While there are many operations that you can just send across to the GPU and not worry about, there are blocking operations that will cause your CPU to stall while it waits for the GPU to finish whatever it's working on. These are bad and should generally be avoided in a retail application, but are generally fantastic for debugging. I expect that the shadow rendering uses some of these blocking calls when they shouldn't, which isn't so much a case of "sloppy PC port" but "sloppy programmer didn't turn off the debug features".
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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GooberMan wrote:
Yeah, I remember it more clearly now. Similar to RE4, many real time cutscenes. Although while RE4 only went pre-rendered for the introductory video, I seem to recall seeing more than just the intro video pre-rendered in RE5.


To add to this, RE4 only rendered cutscenes in game for the GCN release. The PS2 release used pre-rendered clips from the GCN build. You can notice this on the Wii version which retains the original in game rendering for cutscenes during the main missions, but the originally PS2 exclusive Assignment Ada still use pre-rendered clips.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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The PC version of RE4 had prerendered cutscenes too and they looked so awful on a high resolution screen you could hardly tell what was going on >_>
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Phreakuency
Less CG/Realtime cutscene talk more screenshots.

BFBC2 Eyefinity

Saints Row The Third Eyefinity (lower res)

Saints Row The Third Eyefinity (lower res)

Space Marine, including an image of making an Ork explode into glorious gibs.





More Skyrim






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PixieGirl




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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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mikezilla2
Phreakuency
After making a post about it I thought i'd break out the Mirror's Edge screenies icon_razz.gif

Maxed, 4xAA







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Phreakuency




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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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PixieGirl
Really enjoyed Mirrors Edge (back on PS3), should grab it again now that I am a PC gamer icon_wink.gif

A couple more from me, some Skyrim, NBA2K12 and Bulletstorm:








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PixieGirl




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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Those are some really well chosen screenies, I love the Skyrim one and the first bulletstorm one, gorgeous!!!
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Phreakuency




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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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PixieGirl
Frozencry
Cheers icon_smile.gif

One thing I love about gaming on PC is snapping your own 'memories' of your games.

Another Skyrim and Rage...




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PostPosted: Thu Nov 17, 2011 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Amazing place in Skyrim.




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PostPosted: Fri Nov 18, 2011 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Mirrors Edge is a very attractive game.

I should dig up my old EQ1 screenies. I remember looking them a few years ago and thinking to myself 'Damn, the old East Commons Bazaar, I loved that place'
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