Is Project Joystick playing you?

PALGN News | PALGN takes a closer look.

Last Friday, BigPond launched an initiative titled Project Joystick which PALGN reported on here. The project involves the public sending in their ideas for a game, from which BigPond (in conjunction with the Australian Centre for the Moving Image) will "give you the opportunity of a lifetime to turn your game idea into reality". They are "ready to invest over one million dollars to help bring it to life!" This text is lifted straight from the front page of the competition website. Sounds great, huh?

However, Alan Downie – an independent game developer and writer for AustralianGamer.com – recently wrote a blog post critiquing the competition after reading through the terms and conditions:

"Bigpond are harvesting IP. If you win, they will take your idea, create a game from it and you will get $20k in Telstra prizes." Mr Downie said. "Whilst I am all for Bigpond and ACMI promoting the 'idea' of game development, I am extremely disappointed that they would create a competition like this that does not in any way encourage or foster the young and upcoming game development scene in Australia… In my view, this competition is a misleading farce, and if it is not illegal to promote a competition with the tagline, 'We're ready to invest over one million dollars to help bring it to life!', it is certainly immoral."

So, what's this all about then? PALGN took a closer look at the terms and conditions to see if we could find anything unsavoury. One point in particular stood out:

38. By entering into the Promotion, the Eligible Entrant (or their parent/legal guardian on their behalf if they are under 18 years old) agrees and acknowledges that (and may be required to sign a document to the effect that) if they are selected by the Promoter as being one of the 10 most creative, innovative, original and commercially viable Entry Ideas (which will include the Finalists) in the judging process in clause 11:

(a) the Eligible Entrant (or their parent/legal guardian on their behalf if they are under 18 years old), to the extent that any intellectual property rights exist, assigns all rights in their Entry Idea to the Promoter

This seems to imply that the entrants of the 10 best ideas will have signed all the rights to their idea over to BigPond – even if they don’t win the competition. Since this sounded a bit strange to us, we asked a representative from BigPond what was going on here and if people could withdraw their entries after reading this article:

"We will hold rights to the top ten entries only," Craig Middleton from BigPond Corporate Affairs, told PALGN. "There's no facility for people to withdraw their entries. We're completely up-front with the terms and conditions, which people must read and accept before they can even enter. Bear in mind that the competition is open to anyone over the age of 5 and that Project Joystick represents the only real possibility - for anyone not already in the employ of a games studio - to get something other than a 'thanks but no thanks' letter for their game idea. If the game turns into the next mobile or online game blockbuster, the winner will have their name broadcast to the world. On the other side of the coin, BigPond would need a lot of people to buy the game to recoup its investment."

Mr Middleton also clarified the motivation for the project; "The concept behind the competition is to give an opportunity to Joe or Jane Public to have their game idea turned into a real game, recognising that in the games industry, music, movies and book publishing industries, you simply cannot knock on someone's door with your good idea."

So what do you think? Is the competition fair? Let us know in the comments thread for this article. The full terms and conditions for Project Joystick can be found here and the competition website can be found here.

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47 Comments

Mark

4 years ago

It's still a good opportunity for an indy developer or someone trying to get their foot in the videogame industry door.

It's hard enough to get your projects onto the market and to have your name known, so this comp does a good job of putting your name out there and the possibilities follow on from there. Besides, putting something like this on your CV could be pretty helpful.

The only downside is that you'll get **** all compensation if the idea hits off. But then again, you're only providing the idea, not the game itself. Mr. Downie is overracting just a tad, in my opinion.

Djfuzz

4 years ago

Absolutely.

I love it how they go so far on the one hand to single out Joe and Jane Public as people whose IP is pretty much valueless other than in Telstra's pockets, and then say that simply having their name broadcast around the world will be more valuable to non-game developers than any return on their created IP.

What's this costing Telstra? $20K in kind prizes for the winner, nothing for the runners up, and some minor admin fees for running the competition (they're certainly not spending much marketing it, feeding off the free publicity generated by news sites and ACMI).

As an ACMI member, I'm pretty disappointed they've lent their name to this corporate whoring.

troublemaker

4 years ago

I think a fairer idea would have been a cash prize plus a % of royalties on any profits made.

Eyce

4 years ago

I agree on Troublemaker's point of the fact that you're not getting any Royalties.

Potentially if the game sells well (Australian Developer, so let's just assume probably around 50,000-200,000), you're not credited with the idea in a way- You'd only get a small spot in the credits. Effectively you've made the Ball and passing it off before you're even taking a final look at it.

Aftershock

4 years ago

I think its good that they are providing a platform for people to get their name out, but they need to be given royalties, even if its small and a guarantee that their name will be well featured.

Passa

4 years ago

I think its very shameful they get the IP for the top 10 entries..

Regardless, this is still an interesting competition, although I don't feel like entering now heh

Black Mamba

4 years ago

It sounds OK....and would be interesting to see if they can pull it off, or if the game will be a complete flop...

Does kinda worry me about the Top 10 entrants....you'd be pissed off if you were in the top 10....won nothing....and then couldn't take your idea anywhere else knowing it was good....

Plus, what if they use that idea for a second game....without any prize for it????
Surely there could be some legal issues there....

OdensRaven

4 years ago

troublemaker wrote

I think a fairer idea would have been a cash prize plus a % of royalties on any profits made.

Ah yes but when have telstra ever been about being fair? They're a business out to make money. Is it fair that the idea will not be credited with royalties? No, but as if that was ever going to happen! Tops to the person who came up with the idea for this competition as it will serve people right for not reading the terms and conditions. If you want to make money off an idea then you gotta work for it...or be a part of a major corporation and get 5 year olds to do it for you. Its brilliant

Pilliy

4 years ago

This is just something Telstra is doing to try to get popular again.

ittekimasu

4 years ago

while i'm a bit concerned for those who truly put heart and effort into this competition without reading this fine print will be hurt once they find out what will happen to the game in the end.

while i agree that this would be a perfect opportunity to get your foot in the door, i wonder if your successful that you'll get hands on experience working with the dev's in making this come to life. that in itself would be a good prize as well.

doofus

4 years ago

This is all just for contributing an idea!

No coding, no graphics or sound work, nothing like that is needed.

How much value do you put on an idea?

There is no financial cost for you to participate.

Crestfallen

4 years ago

doofus wrote

True. 20k is pretty good for someone who sits on their ass and delivers a vague idea, especially when the idea would die otherwise.

Infested Jibbs

4 years ago

'In Soviet Union, Project Joystick plays YOU!'

Sorry couldn't help myself.

I tell you what, i'd be mighty upset if i did come up with some idea, and it took off and became the next halo and telstra made millions and became a big name in the game business, while the whole time i get no credit for the idea and only have a stack of obsolete broadband modems to remind me of the one i let get away.

DancesInUnderwear

4 years ago

Jibbs wrote

'In Soviet Union, Project Joystick plays YOU!'

Oh thank christ. I've been waiting for it.

doofus is right, though, if you give just some vague idea and they accept it, thats $20 grand in the pocket for no work. Of course on the other hand, if you give them a game idea that becomes the new Tetris or something you're getting royally screwed.

Kashmere

4 years ago

I've got an idea, don't enter.

4 years ago

Hi All!

I thought I’d swing by and add my voice

I do recommend people read my entire post, and the follow up post coming soon on Australian Gamer (sorry to pimp our site). I haven't overracted nearly as much as the first few lines make it seem

I'm totally behind competitions like this, but I am totally opposed to the idea of someone losing their copyright or intellectual property by entering a competition. Now whilst it is true that many people who enter this may have put next to no effort in, you can bet there will be just as many that have been working an idea for months. It is NOT fair that they should lose their Intellectual Property by simply placing in the top 10 of a competition. I can even understand Bigpond taking rights for the "winner" if the game is made, but for the other finalists? No freakin way.

The reality is that Bigpond are obviously intending to make several online games to promote Bigpond. This is a cheap way to get good ideas without paying a development house to come up with them. Make no mistake, Bigpond have the right to make 10 games from the 10 finalist's ideas without any compensation whatsover. They own the IP, they can do what they like.

If Bigpond were serious about supporting independant developers, they would put up this million dollars to help these people actually make their game, and make their first steps into the industry, not just take the IP off them pat them on the back and send them on their way.

The fact is that this "clause" is stuck away under a pile of legal jargon that no one would ever read. The fact that you guys are even discussing it now means I have succeeded in bringing attention to this clause, which is all I wanted to achieve.

OdensRaven

4 years ago

^

Right on brotha! I still think its an ingenious plan

But seriously, if telstra are actually promoting the fact that they are "supporting independent developers" then i think this discussion should take further action then just this board. And once again good on you for bringing it to our attention

BigPond

4 years ago

The 'supporting independent developers' is AJ's assumption. It's a simple competition open to any Australian over the age of 5 and promoted as such.

That's why there are categories for primary and secondary school kids.

If you are a game developer willing to enter and take your chances to get some profile, then that's your choice.

Noone else is standing with a million dollar cheque to turn someone's idea into a game. If they were, you'd be too busy to be posting here.

4 years ago

So BigPond aren't supporting Independent Developers? That kinda contradicts the positioning of the promotion doesn't it?

It is strange, given that ACMI are so active in promoting independent game development that they would be so happy to support a promotion that actively dissuades independent developers by taking their Intellectual Property from them.

For example, on ACMI's Guide to entering Project Joystick there are many references to the fact that this promotion IS in fact targeted at "game makers". http://www.acmi.net.au/joystick_competition_questions_guide.htm

"Be inspired by other Game makers and have a look at their Developer's statements form the Best of the Independent Games Festival 2007. "

ACMI have always been at the forefront of promoting Independant Game Developers in Australia, and I am sure they would've put their name to this promotion for that very reason.

It is clear that ACMI and Bigpond have a very different view on what the achievable outcomes of this promotion are. ACMI are interested in encouraging young developers to get out there and "have a go" at developing game ideas and helping all of them turn their ideas into reality. They put up all the resources and provide so much assistance to young and upcoming developers in an effort to get more people into the industry.

How does taking the intellectual property away from the 10 finalists support that ideal? But as you say, Bigpond aren't running this promotion to support our struggling independant developers.

(EDIT: Apologies to PALGN for hijacking your bulletin board

)

Infested Jibbs

4 years ago

But as you say, Bigpond aren't running this promotion to support our struggling independant developers.

Oh burn Aj lol

4 years ago

In case you are interested what actual developers think of this promotion:

http://www.sumea.com.au//snews.asp?news=2984

They are all in unified agreeance about the terms of this promotion.

Spanca

4 years ago

So this is like Australian Idol for people with ideas for games, but they don't actually have to do anything to make the game. All they have to do is submit an idea with the possibility of getting rewarded with $20k... and that's a bad thing for those people?

I'd agree with you AJ if these people had to do anything to do with making or developing a game, but they don't. They submit an idea and that's it. You're making it out like they're possibly losing something that they've poured their heart and soul into creating. They haven't and don't need to.

4 years ago

Yes, you've made my point precisely.

They will not have anything to do with making THEIR game.

And yes, many people WILL pour their heart and soul into creating this idea. And anyone who actually wants to win, most probably will do just that.

Spanca

4 years ago

If you don't do ANYTHING to create a game, how can you possibly claim it's your game. A game isn't an idea.

Your last post indicates that your problem is that Bigpond aren't giving them a job as a developer. Preeeeetty sure they never indicated that this was a job application.

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