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Chris Leigh
04 Nov, 2005

The Greatest 100 Games Ever: 60-41

PALGN Feature | A closer look at the games you voted in to positions 60-41.
Hello again.

Well, it's fair to say we're gradually moving towards the crème de la crème of the Top 100 that our dear readers voted for, yet don't take anything for granted just yet; you may find a couple of surprise entries in today's list. We won't jabber on too much this time - all we'll say is that if you've not visited the site in the last week or so, then a) shame on you and b) check here to see how this list was compiled. You late arrivals may also want to take a look at which games made it to positions 100-81 here, and the games that ended up ranked between 80 and 61 here. And that's all. Enjoy today's edition!


60
Grim Fandango
PC, 1998
D: LucasArts | P: LucasArts
146 points

Tim Schafer's point-and-click adventure fuses film noir references (the second part of the game is inspired entirely by Casablanca) and Art Deco motifs with a script so dazzlingly original and packed with wit that few other games in this Top 100 - if any - would be able to match it. Set in the Aztec underworld and with a cast that is almost entirely skeletal, the game follows one Manny Calavera, a Grim Reaper and a travel agent to the dead, as he tries to unravel the mystery as to why the righteous deceased are being denied their deserved post-mortem rewards.

The game quickly built up a cult fanbase upon release, and was met with considerable and universal jubilation from the critics as well. However, in a cruelly ironic twist that wouldn't feel out of place in Grim Fandango's meandering plot, the game is often referred to as the final nail in the coffin of point-and-click adventures. For despite the critical adulation the game received, the title failed to sell well, and few publishers have dabbled with the genre since, a loss to gamers everywhere.


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59
Beyond Good & Evil
PlayStation 2, Xbox, GameCube, PC, 2003
D: Ubisoft | P: Ubisoft
153 points

When Michael Ancel and his team finished Beyond Good & Evil in late-2003, it was intended to be the first game in a trilogy. After poor sales however (not helped by Ubisoft's decision to release the game in a swamped Christmas market), the plans for more Beyond Good & Evil titles are on indefinite hold. It's a true shame, and as a result Beyond Good & Evil sits unhappily in that same group of games occupied by the likes of Ico, Rez and Shenmue 2; all great titles, but with a hideous sales record that can be put down to some rather apathetic marketing.

Having said that, the few of us who did manage to dig out this involving and original adventure were amply rewarded. Beyond Good & Evil (the title, incidentally, is a homage to the Friedrich Nietzsche book of the same name) is a beautifully designed videogame, with careful pacing, a haunting soundtrack, superlative voice-acting and an intriguing and elaborate narrative, one with themes of propaganda and press censorship that are curiously relevant to modern society. If you see a copy lying about in your local games emporium, we'd urge you to grab it quickly.


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58
Planescape Torment
PC, 1999
D: Black Isle Studios | P: Interplay
157 points

Black Isle Studios' unique RPG saw players assume control of a mysterious, heavily scarred immortal with pallid grey skin, who wakes up in a mortuary, with no memory of his identity and past experiences. He's joined by Morte, a floating, talking skull who follows him about from place to place throughout the game. Placing an emphasis on conversation and narrative, the title focuses on high-minded concepts such as guilt, redemption, the significance of reality perception and the importance of knowing oneself.

It hardly sounds like a recipe for commercial success, and Planescape: Torment did indeed flop on the high street (thanks, no doubt, to the inadequate marketing that accompanied the release of the game). Nevertheless, it has since joined that small, elite group of games that have become cult classics, and deservedly so.


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57
Killzone
PlayStation 2, 2004
D: Guerilla Games | P: Sony
161 points

It remains to be seen whether or not the 'Halo killer' has lived up to its nickname and finished above the Bungie shooter in this poll, but in the build-up to its 2004 release, expectations that Guerilla's game could topple Master Chief were sky-high. Indeed, Sony reportedly manufactured more than 13 million copies of the game, though with less than 1 million copies of the game sold to date, that may be a decision it regrets. Set on the war-torn dystopia that is the planet Vekta, the title takes in the conflict between humanity and the Helghast, descendants of humans who colonised the planet Helghan generations ago.

Upon release the game received some rather mediocre reviews, and it's true to say it does have it's share of flaws; the level design can be a little samey, whilst the Helghast AI is decidedly shaky on occasions. But there's some superb art design, a strong cinematic feel, wonderful audio work, and a commendably decent multiplayer. Whether it stands up to Halo or it's sequel is another debate entirely that should be reserved for another article.


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56
Banjo-Kazooie
Nintendo 64, 1998
D: Rare | P: Nintendo
162 points

Competing with Super Mario 64 was an unenviable task back in 1998, but developer Rare, fresh from its success with Goldeneye, was hardly a company to shirk a challenge. The end result may not have dislodged Mario from his lofty perch, but Banjo-Kazooie was still an immensely likeable and well-constructed platformer. In truth, the game did little that was markedly different or innovative compared to what had come before - there was the usual snow- and desert-themed worlds that are the staple ingredients of many more mediocre platform games.

But the things that Banjo-Kazooie set out to do were executed with aplomb, with well-designed levels, a great camera, a humorous cast of characters, a sensible number of collectibles and a difficulty curve that was perfectly judged. It all resulted in a streamlined, typically polished Rare package that was a blast to play from start to finish, culminating in a fabulous final bottle with Banjo's nemesis, Grunty the witch. Not all that original, but damn good fun.


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55
Pokémon Gold/Silver
Game Boy Color, 2000
D: Nintendo | P: Nintendo
165 points

It wasn’t the volume of games that led to the explosion of the Pokémon phenomenon, but rather the fact that Nintendo took a proven formula and evolved it in just the right way. And whilst the Pokémon games are now finding a new fanbase, Pokémon Gold/Silver represents the pinnacle of the long-running series. Not only did players suddenly have a whole set of new Pokémon, but new abilites and new areas (in real-time night and day) became available, leaving previous Pokémon games looking slightly redundant.

Contrary to popular belief, there's a great deal more to the Pokémon games than just an annoying bunch of creatures. And in Pokémon Gold/Silver, there was enough content to fill hundreds of gameplay hours, a testament to a brilliant concept and wonderful execution, and proof that Pokémon is much more than the perceived cash-cow that so many people seem to despise. -- Jeremy Jastrzab


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54
Devil May Cry 3: Dante's Awakening
PlayStation 2, 2005
D: Capcom Production Studio 1 | P: Capcom
170 points

After Devil May Cry 2 saw a dip in form for Dante's franchise, Capcom needed to win back the fans and critics left cold by the first sequel. There was considerable relief then when Devil May Cry 3: Dante's Awakening, having earned a positive reception at the E3 2004 convention, was met with universally good reviews when it appeared early the following year. The game represented a return to many of the hallmarks of the first Devil May Cry title, arguably surpassing it in terms of quality.

It's certainly got the looks to justify such a claim, and the combat is as robust and as dynamic as it's ever been. It can also be bewilderingly difficult, one of the few criticisms the title did attract, and one that means that a forthcoming 'Devil May Cry 3: Special Edition' might not be such welcome news to everyone, seeing as it contains a new 'Very Hard' difficulty level. Gulp.

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53
Sonic & Knuckles
Mega Drive, 1994
D: Sonic Team | P: Sega
173 points

Arriving shortly after Sonic the Hedgehog 3, Sonic & Knuckles saw the blue hedgehog joined by red echidna Knuckles for a 2D adventure that allowed players the option of completing the game via two different(ish) routes. The trademarks of the Sonic series are fully evident here, with all the speed and dynamism of the first three titles in place. There was some memorable levels as well: Sky Sanctuary Zone remains a firm PALGN favourite.

The game was also the first (and one of the very few, it should be said) Mega Drive titles to utilise the 'Lock-On Technology', which enabled another cartridge to be plugged in via the socket on top. Thus, plugging either Sonic the Hedgehog 2 or 3 in to the Sonic & Knuckles cart would result in new areas, characters (Knuckles), and title screens being placed in the games. Since then, members of the team behind the game have confessed that the feature was actually a way of making up for the fact that the developers of Sonic 3 had to omit ideas they'd originally wanted to include in their game, due to deadline pressures. Either way, Sonic & Knuckles stands out as one of the very best 2D Sonic titles, though not quite the best if you lot are to be believed...


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52
Soul Calibur
Dreamcast, 1999
D: Namco | P: Namco
185 points

Not many games can wow onlookers with their visuals six years after being released, but then Soul Calibur is not like many games. Boasting jaw-dropping animation, sublime character models and design, not to mention some gorgeous backdrops and a perfect frame-rate, Namco's weapon-based scrapper is indisputedly a visual tour de force.

It wasn't just a pretty face, however. Soul Calibur played gloriously as well, with a supremely refined combat system based on high, medium and low attacks that justly rewarded well-timed blocking and countering moves. It was accessible, but also deep enough so that an expert of the game would always triumph over a beginner. And, just like it's sequel, it had an expansive singleplayer mode alongside an absorbing multiplayer, with a raft of brilliant extras to unlock. Magnificent and indispensable, it's a game everybody should play.


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51
Final Fantasy IX
PlayStation, 2000
D: Square | P: Square
191 points

Developed jointly by studios in Japan and Hawaii, the ninth game in the Final Fantasy series saw Square departing from the more realistic visuals of Final Fantasy VIII. In their place came the super-deformed look of fan's favourite Final Fantasy VII, while the futuristic, technological worlds of VII and VIII were also dropped, in favour of a more medieval setting. The result is a game that's curiously reminiscent of the very earliest Final Fantasy titles, particularly 1987's Final Fantasy.

Despite these changes however, this is familiar Final Fantasy territory in many other ways. A typically absorbing narrative (packed with nods to previous Final Fantasy games) powers the game forwards, and the battle mechanisms, while perhaps not equalling the greatness of Final Fantasy VII's Materia-based system, are as finely tuned and balanced as ever. Sadly, the game had the misfortune of coming out shortly after Sony's new PlayStation 2 console. It was this - combined with the fact that many people were seemingly turned off the series by Final Fantasy VIII - that led to Final Fantasy IX enduring the worst sales performance of any Final Fantasy game over the last decade.


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50
Maniac Mansion: Day of the Tentacle
PC, 1993
D: LucasArts | P: LucasArts
195 points

A good half a decade before coming up with Grim Fandango, Tim Schafer was busy crafting Day of the Tentacle, yet another surreal, oddball LucasArts point-and-click adventure that he co-developed with Dave Grossman, and the follow-up to 1987's Maniac Mansion. At the start of the game, players are placed in the shoes of lovable nerd Bernard, as he leads his two friends Hoagie and Laverne back to the Mansion. However, it emerges that the Purple Tentacle, a creation of one Dr. Fred Edison, drinks radioactive waste from the Mansion and, as a result, quickly grows two stumps for arms and an uncontrollable appetite for global domination. Bernard and friends plan to travel back in time, using Dr. Fred's other creation, the Port-a-Potty-turned-time machine to stop Purple from drinking the toxic waste in the first place.

A mishap occurs though, with Bernard, Hoagie and Laverne all transported to different points in history. This allows for some neat historical interaction between the three friends, where certain puzzles can only be solved by performing specific actions in more than one of the three time zones. We're even treated to some cameos from some famous historical figures, not least George Washington, Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin. About as barmy as any LucasArts point-and-clicker gets, but thoroughly deserving of it's place in the top half of this elite 100.


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49
Burnout Revenge
PlayStation 2, Xbox, 2005
D: Criterion Games | P: Electronic Arts
198 points

As surely the youngest game in this Top 100 - it appeared in Europe only a month or so ago as we write this - many of you may be bemoaning Burnout Revenge's presence here. That said, it is relentlessly good fun. Brainless? A little, but then it doesn't pretend to be anything else, other than a rollickingly good, unpretentious arcade racer, and a game that never lets up when it comes to supplying sheer exhilaration by the bucketload. Measured on this criteria, it succeeds admirably, offering a toe-curlingly fast ride, and with no shortage of technical brilliance.

The aim is simple: race against other souped-up vehicles across busy stretches of city and country roads, all while avoiding - or, better still for extra points, scraping the sides of - civilian traffic. There's various modes to dabble with, all of which offer slightly different slants on how to play the game, but PALGN's favourite must be the quite insane Crash mode, where the premise is to wipe out as many vehicles as you can within a time limit. The crashes are ludicrously over-the-top and fantastically entertaining - like we said, brainless. But it's also hellishly addictive.


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48
Sonic the Hedgehog
Mega Drive, 1991
D: Sonic Team | P: Sega
201 points

Those gamers reared on Mario throughout the 1980s were in for something of a shock when 1991 turned up. Why? Because that was the year that Sega unveiled Sonic the Hedgehog for the Mega Drive, a lightning-fast 2D platformer that was a world away from Mario's more thoughtful, sedate adventures.

Set in levels that were littered with the kind of spectacular loop-the-loops and springboards that are now permanently associated with the series, the game was a bona fide revelation to gamers a decade and a half ago. It remains hugely playable, and certainly one of the strongest 2D Sonic platformers.


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47
Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
PlayStation 2, 2002
D: Konami | P: Konami
204 points

Even Konami must have been taken aback by the reaction that greeted the Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty trailer that it premiered at the 2001 E3 convention. It was a response that triggered months of salivating hype from the gaming press and gamers alike. So much so that, when the game finally appeared in stores a little under a year later, it didn't quite meet the mammoth expectations bestowed upon it.

With the benefit of hindsight and with the hype removed however, it's plain to see that Sons of Liberty is still an immensely impressive ensemble of graphics, sound and gameplay. It's narrative, told largely via codec conversations and some stunning (if rather lengthy) cut-scenes, weaves effortlessly through the game, intertwining with some of the most refined stealth gaming we've ever witnessed. The AI is fantastic, the whole thing still looks jaw-droppingly gorgeous thanks to production values that are simply through the roof, and the introduction remains one of the best ever seen in any game. Now placed at a budget price, it should be high up on any gamer's list, Raiden or no Raiden.


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46
Gran Turismo 4
PlayStation 2, 2004
D: Polyphony Digital | P: Sony
209 points

After being delayed for a grand total of eighteen months by developer Polyphony Digital and having its online mode wrenched out, it would have been understandable if Gran Turismo 4 hadn't quite hit the heights expected of it. Fortunately though, the extra development time paid dividends, with Polyphony delivering the best serious racing game of the past five years.

The majority of consumers seemed to concur, and the game racked up a million sales in its first week on sale in Japan. As usual, the appeal lay in the obsessive attention to detail that the game displayed. The 721 cars on offer came from 80 different manufacturers and spanned a timeline that stretched from 1886 (the Daimler Motor Carriage) to 2022 (the Nissan 350Z concept car). Just as in previous Gran Turismo titles, the handling was endlessly subtle and deep, while the tracks in the game - many of which were new or modified versions of old Gran Turismo favourites - were as exemplary as ever.


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45
Mario Kart 64
Nintendo 64, 1997
D: Nintendo | P: Nintendo
214 points

Mario Kart's transition from 2D to 3D wasn't without the odd growing pain, but it's a sign of Nintendo's ability as a developer that it managed to craft a game that could stand with some pride next to it's SNES predecessor, Super Mario Kart.

Various changes were made to the formula that saw Super Mario Kart capture the heart of many gamers in the early-90s. Some of these alterations were minor nips and tucks, such as the removal of coins and the inclusion of three-lap races, as opposed to five. Other changes were far more wholesale however, with the introduction of analogue control replacing the zippy responsiveness of Super Mario Kart's D-pad, and with tracks that now went up and down, as opposed to just left and right. Perhaps the most notable update of all though was the multiplayer, a mode that now catered for four players, and one that proved almost as irresistible as that other great N64 four-player game, Goldeneye.


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44
The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind
PC, Xbox, 2002
D: Bethesda Softworks | P: Bethesda Softworks
217 points

In a strange way, Morrowind is the Grand Theft Auto of the RPG world, an open-ended, go-anywhere sandbox of a game that allows players to roam, fight, steal and explore as they see fit.

While such liberation is certainly to be encouraged, the game succeeds because it also contains an excellent central narrative (not to mention hundreds of side-quests) that gives the title a strong focus, thus preventing it from being too open-ended for it's own good. It all adds up to an immensely addictive experience, and a game that's hard to put down once you're just a few hours in.


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43
The Secret of Monkey Island
PC, 1990
D: LucasArts | P: LucasArts
220 points

Guybrush Threepwood's first adventure remains arguably his best, and features the familiar mix of minigames, puzzles, in-jokes and anachronisms that would become the trademarks of the next three Monkey Island games.

The script is suitably offbeat and full of knowing wit, while the references to modern-day popular culture and running in-jokes are reeled off at a rate of knots. All in all, a mini-landmark for the point-and-click genre and, even fifteen years on, a joy to play.


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42
Secret of Mana
SNES, 1993
D: Square | P: Square
226 points

This sublime action-orientated RPG from Square is a mainstay of Top 100 lists everywhere, largely thanks to its combination of a deep and genuinely involving story, great characterisation and a range of enemies and environments that manages to look diverse by 2005 standards.

Unusually for Square, the real-time battles are more akin to the combat seen in a 2D Zelda game rather than a Final Fantasy title, with the fluent nature of the fighting aided by the superbly intuitive ring menu system, which let the player switch weapons, cast magical spells and configure the battle behavior of the secondary characters in the blink of an eye. The game's weapon forging and improvement system was revolutionary at the time, while the two-player co-op mode, obtainable once the first companion character has been found, was the icing on a delightfully sweet cake. Essential.


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41
Pro Evolution Soccer 4
PlayStation 2, Xbox, PC, 2004
D: Konami | P: Konami
228 points

While Sensible World of Soccer is rightly regarded as the apogee of 2D videogame football, Konami's Pro Evolution Soccer 4 is the game that rules the roost when it comes to 3D. It's far from being an approachable game at first, but in many ways that's precisely why the series as a whole has attracted such a committed, hardcore fanbase.

Mastering the title can take weeks, even months. Good tackling is an art form, as is successful shooting. Even the outcome of a simple pass is determined by numerous factors; the position of the player's body in relation to the ball, the strength of the foot he's using to make the pass, the condition of the pitch. It's this kind of depth and attention to detail that has made Pro Evolution Soccer 4 and it's various predecessors the choice of the discerning football follower, and the kind of experience that can see entire afternoons float blissfully by.


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_______________________________________________


Thoughts? Speak your mind in the thread here, and keep an eye out over the next day or two for the next instalment of the Top 100 you voted for. Finally, if you'd like a glance at what's made the list so far, scroll down...

100...Final Fantasy XI [90]
099...Soul Calibur 2 [93]
098...NiGHTS Into Dreams [94]
097...Disgaea: Hours of Darkness [95]
096...WipEout 2097 [99]
095...The Sims [100]
094...Silent Hill 2 [103]
093...Quake II [105]
092...F-Zero GX [106]
091...Advance Wars: Dual Strike [107]
=89...Super Smash Bros. [108]
=89...Monkey Island 2: LeChuck's Revenge [108]
088...Gran Turismo 3 [109]
087...God of War [110]
086...Age of Empires 2 [111]
085...Warcraft III [112]
084...Super Mario Sunshine [114]
083...Star Wars Battlefront [115]
082...Conker's Bad Fur Day [116]
081...Chrono Cross [117]
080...Counter Strike [119]
079...Metroid Prime 2: Echoes [120]
078...Golden Sun [121]
077...Fire Emblem [122]
076...Diablo II [123]
075...Civilisation III [124]
074...Advance Wars [125]
073...Phantasy Star Online [127]
072...Lemmings [128]
071...Call of Duty [130]
070...Unreal Tournament [132]
069...The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening [133]
068...System Shock 2 [134]
067...Katamari Damacy [135]
066...Eternal Darkness [136]
065...Doom [137]
064...Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic [138]
063...Rez [139]
062...Tales of Symphonia [140]
061...Final Fantasy VI [143]
060...Grim Fandango [146]
059...Beyond Good & Evil [153]
058...Planescape Torment [157]
057...Killzone [161]
056...Banjo-Kazooie [162]
055...Pokémon Gold/Silver [165]
054...Devil May Cry 3: Dante's Awakening [170]
053...Sonic & Knuckles [173]
052...Soul Calibur [185]
051...Final Fantasy IX [191]
050...Maniac Mansion: Day of the Tentacle [195]
049...Burnout Revenge [198]
048...Sonic the Hedgehog [201]
047...Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty [204]
046...Gran Turismo 4 [209]
045...Mario Kart 64 [214]
044...The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind [217]
043...The Secret of Monkey Island [220]
042...Secret of Mana [226]
041...Pro Evolution Soccer 4 [228]

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49 Comments
6 years ago
just a few comments.

59. Beyond Good & Evil - excellant. yes, if you see it, grab it. in fact the PC version has been under $20 at EB for a few months now, and as part of their sales, so they should have plenty of copies.

58. Planescape Torment - best game on the Baldur's Gate engine IMO (i forget the engine name now). i forgot this game on my list. good to see other's didn't.

57. Killzone - i preferred to Halo, but as i've not played Halo 2, i can't really comment. it seemed more atmospheric, even claustrophobic compared to Halo, which given it's locations compared to Halo, is odd. i would love a PC port of this game, sadly this is likely not to happen.

44. The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind - couldn't disagree more. i hated this game, i just couldn't get into it. that said, i'll probably still try Oblivion.

and i'm glad to see so many point and click games on the list.
6 years ago
So far, only these games have been two low in my books:
F-Zero GX (the most dissaponting position IMO)
Monkey Island 2: LeChuck's Revenge
Super Mario Sunshine
The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening
Eternal Darkness
Day of the Tentacle
Final Fantasy VI
Grim Fandango

And these are the only games that wouldn't have made my list:
Burnout Revenge
Killzone
Star Wars Battlefront
Gran Turismo 4

Of course, this is the time you get worried, and wonder if that great games you love will be right up the top, or totally ignored!
6 years ago
Egads Obs, you prefer Killzone over Halo? Heh, each to their own, and I agree Killzone does get the atmosphere spot-on. But in terms of open-endedness, variation, AI and enemies, it's Halo all the way for me. By a LONG shot. But as I say, each to their own I suppose.
6 years ago
^ i suppose i should elaborate, i didn't play Halo until the PC version, by which time it had aged incredibly and was very stale in the FPS genre. i suppose the same could be said of Killzone, but i just found it was quite decent whereas Halo didn't meet my expectation at all. overhyped i guess.

and like i said, i've not played Halo 2 at all, so this is merely a comparison of Halo 1 vs. Killzone.

and both suck compared to PC FPS games.
6 years ago
Ah Banjo Kazooie my lil bub-im happy all those people who played you didnt forget u.

And Mario Kart 64 prolly shoulda been higher too.......i hope super mario kart doesnt pip it.Super Mario kart was the bomb back in the day, but anyone who has a snes and has played it recently knows that it has aged very........very badly.

And ive always heard such good things about secret of mana but the time people-i have none of it.

One thing with this list is i hope by the end of it we dont have too many games which are very simliar.Like advance wars and advance wars ds-they showed within 15 or so spaces of each other and this pokemon gold entry has got me thinking now too.Maybe either the most polished version of each games(aw:ds or pokemon firered/leafgreen/saphire/ruby) should only have been placed......or......conversely, the first game in the series(aw:original or pokemon red/blue).

But......i guess that would just make stuff to complicated.I just dont want to see some of the coveted top 20 placings being soaked up by the various pokemon colours.icon_eh.gif

Again it needs to be said that Chris is doing a bang up job.The small pieces written for each entry are great icon_y1.gif
6 years ago
Super Mario Kart aged? Ha! It's still miles better than the N64 version in the non-visual stakes.
6 years ago
Beyond Good and Evil was a boring as heck. That's why no one bought it.
6 years ago
Ok Brendan, that clinched it-your officially insane.

To the membrane. icon_dumb.gif

Let me put out the biggest.......oddity in snes amrio kart.You dont steer the character-you steer the screen.Ive got nothing against the visuals and it was great when it was released, dont get me wrong... but mario kart 64(im not quite sure what the 'growing pains' are reffered to in the article) is head and shoulders above it.

And if anyone complains about the rubber band ai, cmon.......it makes the races interesting!
6 years ago
Brendan wrote
Super Mario Kart aged? Ha! It's still miles better than the N64 version in the non-visual stakes.
quoted for emphasis.

SMK is still a party favourite in our crowd. MK64 is rubbish by comparision. in fact mk64 was what i was going to buy a N64 for back when they were the new console, and after playing it, i never got a N64 until a few months ago.
6 years ago
Jibbs-i like the color red

Obs-red sucks-blue is the best!
6 years ago
The engine is the Infinity engine.

My personal favourite is Baldurs Gate II plus expansion.

I have Icewind Dale II loaded up on my PC at home but alas never got past the first 2 hours. Cheap though $10 icon_smile.gif.
6 years ago
I agree, while Super Mario Kart was fantastic, I think Mario Kart 64 runs laps around it. Better multiplayer and selection of tracks.

Double Dash was a disgrace though and I'm glad no one was stupid enough to vote for it... yet.
6 years ago
'Jibbs-i like the color red

Obs-red sucks-blue is the best!'


^^ Quite, but then debate on these things is healthy. icon_wink.gif

Personally, I like both Mario Kart 64 and Super Mario Kart. The 'growing pains' I was referring to can basically be boiled down to two things:

1. The rubber band AI. Yes, I appreciate you think they make races interesting. To me, it felt grossly unfair at times, like a bad design decision.

2. Control. Nothing wrong with analogue control of course, but I've always thought these cartoony kart games were far better with digital control, as D-pads offer a (to quote myself from the article) 'zippy responsiveness' that analogue control can't match. D-pads feel more instant, somehow.

In other words, Super Mario Kart for me as well, matey. Sorry. icon_wink.gif
6 years ago
Brendan (and others) wrote
Super Mario Kart aged? Ha! It's still miles better than the N64 version in the non-visual stakes.
You guys are crazy.

Not to diss SMK in any way, but even just the four player would put MK64 over the top for me. Sure, only two battle stages were any good, but SMK's battle stages were all basically exactly the same, apart from the slippy ice on one. For racing, MK64 also had the great 4 player, good unique tracks (SMK's tracks are all very similar since they're all flat - except the bowser and ice stges), and good character differentation. The AI should have been better, but it was no worse then SMK (forgivable for SMK since it was an older game, but hardly an argument that the sequel was inferior).

SMK was a better game for it's time then MK64 was for it's time, but MK64 ultimatley was the better game.

I'll concede SMK ruled for single player, though - but that wasn't the point of MK64. I watched people play 4 player MK64 for literally thousands of hours in my college at uni. I don't know how my N64 survived!

EDIT: Also, what Mark said. Except you should give MKDD a fair go too - ever play 8 player LAN?

EDIT 2: It's an all in staff (plus Jibbs and Obs) brawl!
6 years ago
David wrote
Brendan wrote
Super Mario Kart aged? Ha! It's still miles better than the N64 version in the non-visual stakes.
You guys are crazy.
No, it is YOU that is crazy. Jibbs as well... probably more so though.

I purchased Super Mario Kart a couple months back and threw it on the SNES and had the time of my life all over again. Yes, I even prefer the graphics. I hate the changes in MK64 and think it is definitely subpar. No coins you say? Bah! No powerup boxes on the ground? Bah! Boring tracks! Bah!

MK:DD I haven't played enough of, but I'm hanging for MK:DS because of the return to the style of the original and best Mario Kart ever. This won't change, 4 player or no 4 player. Online or no online.

I totally agree with both ObsoletE and Chris-Leigh's comments (well done on the write up mate), and I am 100% sure that Super Mario Kart will place much higher in the list of top 100. If not, it will really tell a lot about the gamers on this site icon_wink.gif
6 years ago
No, never played LAN for MKDD. It's suppose to be pretty exciting from what I've heard, but I don't think it could change my opinion on the game's gameplay. I thought the double person karts was a little off, some of the levels were uninspiring and it just didn't feel like Mario Kart.

But I agree with David, Mario Kart for me has always been about multiplayer, and I think Mario Kart 64 provided one of the best multiplayer experiences for the console. Super Mario Kart was fantastic, but was limited. Mario Kart 64 expanded on the game, and expanded on the overall multiplayer experience, which is a major positive in my opinion.
6 years ago
Yeah fair enough thats cool to those who are into smk

In regards to Chris' comments-

I reckon first with the rubber band ai, im not one to toot my own horn, but at the highest diffculty i smoke the computer, and if it werent for the ai id be racing all by lonesome for the last two laps.I can see how if you just bought the game, or were younger, or not as good, it could certainly get frustraing, like a big fat red shell 100 m before the finsih line when your first, dropping you to 5th or worse....

And i always found the analogue control to be super.It makes the powersliding 'power increase/boost(the white-yellow-red....VEEEEEE's) mcuh easier to pull off due to how you can 'flick' the stick back and forth to change the power.You only ever use left or right when steering, and analogue provides a bit more precision when racing(appreciated on bowsers castle and yoshi's valley especially).

Call me unco but i just get used to super mario kart's odd 'steer the screen not the racer' mode 7 style racing.I use to be able to, but....alas not anymore.

And the 4 player 64 version multu leaves super mario karts 2 player feeling a lil undercooked.Either way-there both great!But 64 is better imo. icon_biggrin.gif
6 years ago
'It's an all in staff (plus Jibbs and Obs) brawl!'

We do all seem rather divided on this. icon_lol.gif

But as Brendan and I are editors, we win. icon_evil.gif icon_razz.gif
6 years ago
Jibbs wrote
Yeah fair enough thats cool^
Which of the several posts within a few minutes are you referring to with that arrow? lol
6 years ago
Jibbs: i wasn't specifically arguing for the sake of an argument, i'm sure you get this, but just in case you think i'm just countering all your comments because it's you, i'm not.

now that i think about it, i think it was the "steer the screen" that i liked about SMK over MK64. (again, not trying to simply say "nah" to your "yeah", you simply reminded me of something i liked about it). maybe if we'd given MK64 a better go it would be the party game of choice, but we've stuck with SMK.

i also think it's much easier to pick up and play for the first time (or drunk), compared to MK64.
6 years ago
Chris-Leigh wrote
'It's an all in staff (plus Jibbs and Obs) brawl!'

We do all seem rather divided on this. icon_lol.gif

But as Brendan and I are editors, we win. icon_evil.gif icon_razz.gif
We'll have to have a MK DS online battle to decide which is superior! Mark, Jibbs and myself vs Brendan, CL, theory and Obs.
6 years ago
3 vs 4?

Thats a lil unfair.....

For them icon_twisted.gif
6 years ago
I'm up for that David. Once Australia gets online Mario Kart in 2008, of course. icon_twisted.gif
6 years ago
Noooooo Morrowind only got position 44 icon_sad.gif

its...not...fiar icon_razz.gif j/k

at least it rated icon_smile.gif
i was kind of expecting it to come lower being a very focused game
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